Can you elaborate on #2? The question is not clear to me.
Are you asking about moral relativism?
Hello everyone, I would like to have a friendly discussion. I am a Christian and would like to ask some questions.
1. If God does exist is there anything you would ask him?
2. As an atheist do you believe morals are absolutes or are they subjective? Why?
3. Does your outlook on Christianity come from what you observe Christians doing?
4. What do you dislike most about religion?
Can you elaborate on #2? The question is not clear to me.
Are you asking about moral relativism?
Yes, I am asking the views of moral relativism and why you take this stance, if you do.Originally Posted by Biggin
1. -----
2. I am not sure of the answer you want for this; I do not believe in moral relativism per se, as support of the whole theory. The problem with moral objectivity is that it almost always means forcing one set of morals on a whole society. That in itself is immoral. I believe that morals are individual decisions on how one should behave; Those morals can be shaped by any number of things.
It is difficult to provide an answer, because I am not religious, therefore not a moral objectivist. But that does not have to mean I believe in moral relativism. I believe that there are rights and wrongs, but it is an individual decision to determine what is right or wrong.
Because to force morals on another is immoral in itself.
3. My outlook on Christianty is formed by many different pieces. My views are formed on a combination of the history of the religion, scientific evidence, and how Christians act in society.
4. Why do I have to dislike religion to be an athetist? I have no hatred for no other religion, I do not dislike a certain set because of their religious views. I feel that individuals are trying to make a whole set of people fall into line with a moral and ethical ideology based on their religion. To be more clear, I feel that individuals who use their religious beliefs to make political decisions and suggestions that affect society as a whole are morally wrong.
If it is an individuals decision to determine what right and wrong are does this mean thatmorals in essence would be determined by the persons acting or reacting? What measuring stick would be in place to hold the person accountable?
What part of the history of Christianity do you think has influenced you in a negative way? Why would you take the word of Science or evolution theory over God? Have I missed it? Missed where Science has disproven God and creation? I am unaware that htis has happened.
Do you hold God accountable for the actions of others? We cannot judge a person based on how someone else acts can we? Even though God does not change, people do.
I do not think any views your views, or my views should be forced on anyone. Every person alive has the right to make their own decisions, but a society and it's leadership does what they feel is best for all people. Can you give some examples of decisions you have observed that would indicate that they were influenced by a religious belief.
I gain my morals and ethics from God's Word, but by no means am I indicating that everyone has to do this. God says to choose this day who we will serve. Two important details in that saying, one being we have a choice and the other being we are not forced to accept or adhere to his ways.
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I believe there are a certain set of rights and wrongs that most all people are born with at birth, that humans are inherently good. That humans are born with a conscience that determines what is right and wrong on a very basic level. After that, morals are determined by many other factors, environment, social situation, heritage, etc..If it is an individuals decision to determine what right and wrong are does this mean thatmorals in essence would be determined by the persons acting or reacting? What measuring stick would be in place to hold the person accountable?
What part of the history of Christianity do you think has influenced you in a negative way? Why would you take the word of Science or evolution theory over God? Have I missed it? Missed where Science has disproven God and creation? I am unaware that htis has happened.
Do you hold God accountable for the actions of others? We cannot judge a person based on how someone else acts can we? Even though God does not change, people do.
I do not think any views your views, or my views should be forced on anyone. Every person alive has the right to make their own decisions, but a society and it's leadership does what they feel is best for all people. Can you give some examples of decisions you have observed that would indicate that they were influenced by a religious belief.
I gain my morals and ethics from God's Word, but by no means am I indicating that everyone has to do this. God says to choose this day who we will serve. Two important details in that saying, one being we have a choice and the other being we are not forced to accept or adhere to his ways.
The history of Christianity is filled with examples of people being murdered for being heretic. For not being Christian. How can that not have a negative connotation to a religion?
No one has disproven the existence of an omnipotent being. But science has been able to give us small clues about human existence and the evolution of man. I choose to take the word of science because science is a fact-based decision. Religion is an emotional decision, a matter of blind faith and belief in something that cannot be proven.
I choose to side with facts and truths over speculation and faith.
I do not hold an omnipotent being to a standard because I do not believe in the existence of a higher being.
The easiest example is homosexuality legislation, which is directly related to the Christian ideology that homosexuality is not natural, and therefore should not be allowed to be seen by the government as married individuals, therefore not being able to receive the same government benefits as married people.
There has been legislation in the last few years to advance the situation of homosexuals, but the point that there is still legislation against a set of people because it is viewed as wrong by a religious organization is proof that religion influences politics. Court rulings on obscenity and pornography are more proof, the ideal that certain acts should not be allowed because they are immoral is deeply rooted in religious connotation.
Actually studies show that it is the opposite, we aquire traits and characteristics. From adolesence to adulthood we aquire learned traits. Do you think people are born racist? You and I both know they are not, it is learned.
What you call the history of Christianity is misleading for this reason, What we must consider is this, Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is one. It is easy to distinguish between true beleivers and those who are not.
What small clues from evolution are you talking about? We have no tranitional fossils, besides fossils in the science community cannot be used as evidence to evolution. The Big Bang is only a theory that attempts to explain away creation, that is clearly seen to be the motive, especially after studying the history of Darwinism.
Homosexuality is not normal human behavior and Science supports this. It is considerd abnormal behavior. Do you realize that a very small percentage of people in this world interact in this lifestyle? I am not using this as evidence, but the majority of the population rejects this lifestyle for a reason. Are you saying it is natural for a person of the same sex to desire each other? Rememeber Science has went on record as saying homosexuals are not born gay, therfore it has to be a learned trait.
As a whole we are not saying they cannot be homosexual, we are saying they are not bringing into marriage, a marriage that from history shows it is between a man and a woman. I know atheists that are against this lifestyle so the theory that only religious people think this way cannot be true.
Do you think porn is a good influence on anyone, especially children? Do you feel like it demoralizes women?
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We acquire almost all morals in early life and adolescence, but I do believe that at birth, most people know a general right and wrong, the conscience.Actually studies show that it is the opposite, we aquire traits and characteristics. From adolesence to adulthood we aquire learned traits. Do you think people are born racist? You and I both know they are not, it is learned.
What you call the history of Christianity is misleading for this reason, What we must consider is this, Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is one. It is easy to distinguish between true beleivers and those who are not.
What small clues from evolution are you talking about? We have no tranitional fossils, besides fossils in the science community cannot be used as evidence to evolution. The Big Bang is only a theory that attempts to explain away creation, that is clearly seen to be the motive, especially after studying the history of Darwinism.
Homosexuality is not normal human behavior and Science supports this. It is considerd abnormal behavior. Do you realize that a very small percentage of people in this world interact in this lifestyle? I am not using this as evidence, but the majority of the population rejects this lifestyle for a reason. Are you saying it is natural for a person of the same sex to desire each other? Rememeber Science has went on record as saying homosexuals are not born gay, therfore it has to be a learned trait.
As a whole we are not saying they cannot be homosexual, we are saying they are not bringing into marriage, a marriage that from history shows it is between a man and a woman. I know atheists that are against this lifestyle so the theory that only religious people think this way cannot be true.
Do you think porn is a good influence on anyone, especially children? Do you feel like it demoralizes women?
I am talking about the Crusades, the Dark Ages, the period in time that Christianity ruled most of the modern world, and people were MURDERED for believing in science or speaking out against the church.
You did an nice job of TOTALLY bypassing my question. Answer me this; was it okay for historical Christians to murder those who did not share their beliefs? Was it okay to murder people who refused to convert?
Your book does not even mention dinosaurs, most deny their existence. Do you deny that dinosaurs existed?
Lame way to try and justify your hate. Black people for the longest time were viewed as abnormal, is that okay? No.
It is NOT okay to discriminate against a set of people. To deny homosexuals rights has NOTHING to do with science or FACTS. It is purely about Christian beliefs on it. And you are not quoting leading research factually. There are factors that can make people born gay, such as an excess of prenatal estrogen. Also, the scientific community has stated that homosexuals feel no choice, they have no say in how they feel. Therefore, its nothing to do with being different, it has everything to do with being a sin in Christian religion.
I think repressing sexuality leads to numerous problems that occur that could be solved by being more open and honest about sex.
Do you believe in abstinence?
Porn is only degrading to those who choose to view it that way. Those woman choose to make their living that way, they make their money by having sex. How can that be degrading? Shoot if I could make a living having sex with beautiful women all day, I would be there ASAP
You did an nice job of TOTALLY bypassing my question. Answer me this; was it okay for historical Christians to murder those who did not share their beliefs? Was it okay to murder people who refused to convert?
** I know this wasn't directed at me but I will answer with my opinion. I think that it is wrong to murder people for their beliefs or lack thereof.
I would not want to be murdered for my beliefs as I am sure no one else would want to be murdered for theirs.
Your book does not even mention dinosaurs, most deny their existence. Do you deny that dinosaurs existed?
** I believe dinosaurs existed.
It is NOT okay to discriminate against a set of people. To deny homosexuals rights has NOTHING to do with science or FACTS. It is purely about Christian beliefs on it. And you are not quoting leading research factually. There are factors that can make people born gay, such as an excess of prenatal estrogen. Also, the scientific community has stated that homosexuals feel no choice, they have no say in how they feel. Therefore, its nothing to do with being different, it has everything to do with being a sin in Christian religion.
** While I don't believe that people are born gay and I believe that it is a sin, I do NOT discriminate against anyone. Discrimination is wrong is any case. I have known some Homosexuals and am just as friendly with them as I would be anyone else because they are people too just like you and I. We were all born with free will and what you do with that is your choice. I don't like it when people discriminate against Christians so I wouldn't want to do that to them. I try to practice the "Do unto others" concept.
I think repressing sexuality leads to numerous problems that occur that could be solved by being more open and honest about sex.
Do you believe in abstinence?
** I didn't believe in abstinence as a teen
Actually SOME teens that end up pregnant end up being better mothers than those who wait until they are in their late 20's to 30's.
As for the porn, I am gonna leave that question alone.
You did an nice job of TOTALLY bypassing my question. Answer me this; was it okay for historical Christians to murder those who did not share their beliefs? Was it okay to murder people who refused to convert?
** I know this wasn't directed at me but I will answer with my opinion. I think that it is wrong to murder people for their beliefs or lack thereof.
I would not want to be murdered for my beliefs as I am sure no one else would want to be murdered for theirs.
Your book does not even mention dinosaurs, most deny their existence. Do you deny that dinosaurs existed?
** I believe dinosaurs existed.
It is NOT okay to discriminate against a set of people. To deny homosexuals rights has NOTHING to do with science or FACTS. It is purely about Christian beliefs on it. And you are not quoting leading research factually. There are factors that can make people born gay, such as an excess of prenatal estrogen. Also, the scientific community has stated that homosexuals feel no choice, they have no say in how they feel. Therefore, its nothing to do with being different, it has everything to do with being a sin in Christian religion.
** While I don't believe that people are born gay and I believe that it is a sin, I do NOT discriminate against anyone. Discrimination is wrong is any case. I have known some Homosexuals and am just as friendly with them as I would be anyone else because they are people too just like you and I. We were all born with free will and what you do with that is your choice. I don't like it when people discriminate against Christians so I wouldn't want to do that to them. I try to practice the "Do unto others" concept.
I think repressing sexuality leads to numerous problems that occur that could be solved by being more open and honest about sex.
Do you believe in abstinence?
** I didn't believe in abstinence as a teen
Actually SOME teens that end up pregnant end up being better mothers than those who wait until they are in their late 20's to 30's.
As for the porn, I am gonna leave that question alone.
Historical Christians? It would be better if you said historical religious people wouldn't it? I understand that they may have claimed to be Christians, but clearly they did not exibit the characteristics that would point to them being a Bible Christian.
Murdering someone for thier unbelief or refusing to convert is never okay and God does not think so either. Can you swear to it that God motivated them to do that? Dino's did exist and I am sure God is aware of that since he created them. If evidence was found that Dino's and humans walked together would this destroy the theory of evolution?
Denying homosexuals rights goes much deeper than just being a religious view, there are secular people as well that do not see this as being a good example to teach our younger generation. I know this is what the homosexual community and the atheists like to blame it on, but in reality secular people feel the same way.
Do you think it is discriminating just because we do not condone a homosexual lifestyle? We are not hatin on them or going to their houses and breaking their relationships up. We only stand united and say we will not allow this, marriage has always been between a man and a woman and it does not send a good meassage ot the little eyes that will be on them.
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